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April 30, 2025 at 1:23 pm
bs
SubscriberFrom my understanding, the creation of periodic surfaces in TurboGrid only depends on the shape of the associated main blade's high and/or low surfaces ("Periodic And Passage Interface Surface Method = Blade Extents"). Although this typically doesn't result in any issues, it prevents the user from adjusting/defining the periodic interfaces. If this is the case it means that the "Periodic Surface Bias" CCL setting and the "Low Periodic" & "High Periodic" objects in the geometry tab are completely ignored.
I have a unique problem which requires absolute control of the shape of the periodic surface but I'm struggling to see if it is at all possible since the user guide is quite lacking in this regard. I see several CCL settings which might allow me to manually define the periodic surface but there is no information online about them. Would someone be able to help me? -
May 7, 2025 at 5:33 pm
rfblumen
Ansys EmployeeThe meshing methods used in TurboGrid are highly automated, thereby not requiring user intervention to achieve a mesh with optimal quality. Therefore, the user doesn't have control over the mesh topology. This includes the mesh on the periodics. Although the CCL setting "Periodic Surface Bias" accessed under Blade Set can be modified, it only affects the geometry and not the resulting mesh topology or mesh.
If absolute control of the periodic surfaces of the blade passage is required, an alternate approach would be to generate a blade passage in BladeEditor using the "Stage Fluid Zone" feature. The periodic surfaces on this solid body can then be modified as desired. Meshing of the blade passage body could be done in Ansys Meshing or Fluent Meshing.
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May 8, 2025 at 6:57 am
bs
SubscriberThank you for the response. I was worried that might be the case. I have previously meshed a design in Fluent Meshing using its BladeEditor geometry although its flow characteristics consistently differed from its Turbogrid counterpart, I'm assuming the tet cells in the hexcore mesh might be the cause.Â
I found that the "Periodic And Passage Interface Surface Method" setting accepts "From file", suggesting that the periodic surface can be specified instead of using "Blade Extents". I also saw in the Turbogrid User Guide that one should be able to export periodic surfaces, "2.12.3. Save Periodic/Interface Surfaces Command" although the command doesn't show for me. I was hoping that would give me a hint as to the format of the input file, if you know what the format of this file is (specifically the headers in the .curve file for the 2 curves) I could give it a go. From your response I assume the feature has been removed so its likely a long shot. -
May 9, 2025 at 4:13 pm
rfblumen
Ansys EmployeeUnfortunately, there are references in the documentation for TurboGrid that were relevant prior to the ATM (Automated Topology and Meshing) method. The prior TurboGrid method (the "Control Point" approach) allowed for control over the mesh periodics. This outdated material in the documentation will be removed in the next release.Â
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February 20, 2026 at 4:28 pm
rotundo
SubscriberDid you manage to find a solution to this from within TurboGrid? I am facing the same problem.
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February 20, 2026 at 8:25 pm
bs
SubscriberUnfortunately not, in the end I had to use an open source mesher to get the job done. Good luck.
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February 20, 2026 at 9:39 pm
rfblumen
Ansys EmployeeThe mesh for the periodics from TurboGrid is not available in TurboGrid as geometry. The only way to extract periodic surface geometry from a TurboGrid mesh, that I'm aware of, is to import the TurboGrid mesh into a Geometry tool like SpaceClaim, Discovery or ICEM CFD, and then convert the mesh into geometry. The periodic surface geometry can then be extracted.
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February 20, 2026 at 9:44 pm
rotundo
SubscriberYeah, this is what I am currently working on. I managed to export the mesh and then convert it to a generic cad geometry file. I need to clean up the faces and then create one periodic face, which I will create an input file from. I will offset this face by the pitch angle to define the periodic interfaces. I know how to provide these as an input to TurboGrid, although I do not know how the files should be formatted.
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February 20, 2026 at 11:58 pm
rfblumen
Ansys EmployeeIt's not possible to specify periodic mesh faces for TurboGrid using geometry input. The periodic mesh faces in TurboGrid are determined by the ATM method in TurboGrid during the meshing process and are different from the geometric periodic surfaces in TurboGrid generated based on the mean camber surface of the blade. You can see this by comparing the surface "Low Periodic" under Geometry in the TurboGrid tree outline with "LOWPERIODIC" under 3D Mesh.
The approach I mentioned for extracting the geometry from the TurboGrid periodic mesh faces would be applicable if one wanted to investigate a blade in a bladerow that is different from the neighboring blades in the blade row. The assumption is that the neighboring blades were meshed in TurboGrid. The "different" blade geometry would use the extracted periodic face mesh geometry from TurboGrid but would need to be meshed in a different mesher (e.g. Ansys Meshing, Fluent Meshing, ICEM CFD) that TurboGrid.
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July 14, 2026 at 10:28 am
rotundo
SubscriberI know it has been a while, but I thought that I would share the alternative solution that I came up with to solve this problem, in case it helps someone in the future, and also in hopes that a more mature version of this could be included as a feature in a future release. I ended up creating a template TurboGrid state file for my blades, and I have a small script to extract the CAD geometry into curve files for each individual blade that I am interested in studying. Because the geometry perturbations are mostly localized to the leading edge and the first ~20–25% of the chord, and are usually small, the same mesh template works for all my cases. Although the pitch is the same, the periodic wall gets reshaped for each blade, which results in fairly large gaps when I try to assemble the model in CFX. I did some preliminary studies with multiple domains and GGIs between boundaries, but I found that this was an unsatisfying solution and the gaps were a source of considerable numerical inaccuracy.
To get around this, I actually didn't stop using TurboGrid. Instead, I made a small MATLAB script that computes displacement functions that map each node on the perturbed periodic boundary onto the nominal periodic boundary. Then, I have a template CCL file that I fill in with the output from the script, which can be loaded into a small CFX model with mesh deformations turned on. CFX lets you drive aÂ
Specified Displacementmesh-motion BC with a 3-D interpolationFUNCTIONkeyed on the initial node coordinates. So I precompute a per-node displacement that moves every node of the damaged passage's periodic wall exactly onto the target (nominal) periodic surface, ship it as an interpolation table, and ramp it in over a fluids-off pseudo-transient. The deformed mesh then has a periodic surface geometrically identical to the nominal one, and a standard automatic mesh connection should then work without any other modifications. Actually, in most cases, the model can use a 1:1 connection.A minimal example of what this could look like is below:
FUNCTION: High Periodic DX Option = Interpolation Argument Units = [m], [m], [m] Result Units = [m] INTERPOLATION DATA: Option = Three Dimensional Data = x1,y1,z1,dx1, x2,y2,z2,dx2, ... # One table per component, per wall END END ... BOUNDARY:MESH MOTION: Option = Specified Displacement DISPLACEMENT: Option = Cartesian Components Displacement X Component = High Periodic DX(Initial X, Initial Y, Initial Z) * min(1.0, t/1[s]) Displacement Y Component = High Periodic DY(Initial X, Initial Y, Initial Z) * min(1.0, t/1[s]) Displacement Z Component = High Periodic DZ(Initial X, Initial Y, Initial Z) * min(1.0, t/1[s]) END END END ... FLOW: Flow Analysis EXPERT PARAMETERS: solve emag = f solve energy = f solve fluids = f solve fsd = f solve masfrc = f solve mixture fraction = f solve postproc masfrc = f solve postproc tvariance = f solve radiation = f solve reaction progress = f solve scalar = f solve soot = f solve temperature variance = f solve turbulence = f solve volfrc = f solve wallscale = f transient initialisation override = t END END Another problem that I ran into was getting the displacement right, since a naive nearest-point projection folds the surface mesh. I have two different mapping procedures, depending on the meshes, and the script verifies injectivity in both cases:
- Direct: The exact node-to-node transformation, which works only when the two non-matching walls share the same mesh topology (this should work for all of my cases, since the passage meshes usually come from the same template). There is no interpolation, and I have checks in my code to ensure that the meshes are conformal before actually performing the mapping.
- Floater mean-value: I flatten both walls to the unit square with strictly positive (mean-value) weights. In this way, a piecewise-linear map to a convex domain with positive weights cannot fold. I then lift each perturbed node, via its unit-square image, onto the nominal wall. The result is a wall-to-wall map defined by a composition of two flattening homeomorphisms, Φ = σnominal-1 ∘ σperturbed, and is therefore injective by construction.
To summarize, my workflow from end-to-end looks like this:
- Export the high/low periodic wall node clouds + face connectivity for the nominal and damaged passages (CFX profile layout:
[Data]+[Faces]). - Run the offline script → injective displacement map per wall + autofilled CCL with the six interpolation functions (High/Low × DX/DY/DZ) and the mesh-motion BCs.
- Import the CCL, run a short mesh-only pseudo-transient (fluids/turbulence off,
transient initialisation override) to ramp the morph in. - Use the deformed mesh; the periodic surfaces now match for a 1:1 interface.
It seems like the missing piece is on the pre-processing side. If TurboGrid or CFX-Pre could natively align a passage's periodic surface onto a specified target surface (a neighbour's wall, or an imported one) with a fold-free guarantee, or equivalently let an interface be specified between non-identical passages and build the conforming morph itself, it would make mistuning, erosion, and as-manufactured-geometry studies a lot easier. I also would be happy to share code or CCL files that I am using for this.
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